"The Forever War"

[asterroc]

Started reading "The Forever War" by Joe Haldeman (traditional print book), and it is reaffirming my love of older science fiction / speculative fiction.

A few comments about the first 50 pages of the book; I don't think they're spoilers, but you might.

In the very first chapter, the narrator says they're going to a planet out past Pluto's orbit, named Charon, and with a double-take I checked the copyright date. 1974. Dwarf planet Pluto's first moon Charon was discovered in 1978 (second and third moons, Nix and Hydra, weren't discovered until 2005), so it's in fact prophetic for Haldeman to name a "tenth planet" after the ferryman of the dead to the underworld.

Also amusing is how he "predicts" that in the future interstellar armies will conscript men and women equally, and set up rosters for sex rotations. It's not entirely clear *why* they have this setup, and it certainly hasn't yet discussed how they prevent STDs and pregnancies (leave it to male authors to skip that part), but I always find it amusing to see how "classic" sci-fi always assumes a complete sexual revolution in this respect, while remaining chauvinistic in other manners (though so far I haven't seen any particular chauvinism).

Comments

[rosefox]

though so far I haven't seen any particular chauvinism

Other than the women being forced to "service" the men?

[galbinus-caeli.livejournal.com]

It was 1974. Penicillin and its successors were expected to soon be able to cure all STDs and the pill to prevent all unwanted pregnancies.

By the way, joe_haldeman is a very active live journaler.

[galbinus-caeli.livejournal.com]

And the men expected to service the women.

[jrtom.livejournal.com]

I assume that you're aware of the connection between this book and Starship Troopers...I'll leave it at that until you're done if you prefer.

[rosefox]

I don't recall quite so much about that, but it's been a while since I read it; I just remember a pair of women described as run ragged by the enforced sexual rotation with all the horny guys in their battalion, and being very glad when reinforcements showed up.

[galbinus-caeli.livejournal.com]

That is true, but it is seen as an unusual and slightly disreputable situation for the command to have allowed that to happen.

But you are right too that there is significant unspoken (and almost certainly unintended) sexism. 1960s and 1970s SF was rife with it.

[rosefox]

2000s fiction isn't much better. *)

[zandperl.livejournal.com]

I dunno, I feel like the men are forced to service the women as well, or so it's been so far, I don't know if it changes later in the book.

[zandperl.livejournal.com]

The foreword mentions that they're both considered seminal sci-fi war novels, and I have read the other, but it was quite a while ago.

[jrtom.livejournal.com]

The Forever War was written, in part, as a response to Starship Troopers. As such I interpret at least some of its elements in that light.

If you read Haldeman's 1969 (a war and post-war novel, based in part on Haldeman's own experiences in Viet Nam) you'll get an interesting alternate perspective on The Forever War.

[zandperl.livejournal.com]

Hm, interesting. I'll have to skim a summary of Starship Troopers to remind myself of it.

[zandperl.livejournal.com]

Oh yup, I just read that part. It seemed to me it could have as easily gone the other way, w/ two men being run ragged by all the women, but it still didn't sit well with me.

[zandperl.livejournal.com]

Now that I've finished it, one of my first responses was that the ending was too cliche - but then I realized it was because everyone else copied him. Orson Scott Card, for example, borrowed a LOT from this novel in Ender's Game.